dh003i ([info]dh003i) wrote,
@ 2005-02-11 23:51:00
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If you're my friend, Prof. Hoppe you shall defend
To all of my friends, and anyone else reading this... A great professor, an excellent and highly respected Austrian economist, Prof. Hans-Hermann Hoppe, has come under attack by the PC-police. In his lecture, Time Preference and Its Implications, he discussed the phenomenon of time-preference, the preferring of present satisfaction over future satisfaction. All human beings have some degree of time-preference; this is inherent in the fact that we act. If we didn't have time-preference, we would never act. A person with a high time-preference has a high preference for present satisfaction (present goods) over future satisfaction (future goods); a person with low time-preference has a low preference for present satisfaction over future satisfaction.

The portion of the lecture that Prof. Hoppe has gotten in trouble over is the part where he gives several examples to illustrate the phenomenon of time-preference. He notes that the very old and the very young tend to have high time-preferences. He also briefly notes that homosexuals tend to have higher time-preferences.

Although Prof. Hoppe's been giving this lecture for 18 or so years, with no complaints, one student was offended by this. So, he complained to an administrator. The next class, Prof. Hoppe mentioned it, and said that he was only speaking in generalities -- that is, certainly such was not a specific statement about any homosexual person, anymore than his comment about the elderly would be specific about an old person (like Warren Buffet, who obviously has high time-preference even in his late 70s) -- and did not mean to offend anyone. The student, however, felt that this was "dismissive", and complained further. Now, the University of Las Vegas -- where Prof. Hoppe works -- wants to "punish" him, by issuing a letter of reprimand and cancelling his next payraise.

So, I'm curious. What do you think? I have intentionally left out the details of what Prof. Hoppe said because I want you all to listen to the lecture before making a judgement. Please do this. I think it is important to hear the entire lecture, and not simply make a judgement based on a sound-byte. The lecture is approximately one hour long, but is well worth the time (even ignoring this entire situation). I think you will find Prof. Hoppe to be a calm and enjoyable person to listen to, and even funny at times.

Here is some contact information, so that you can get in touch with the University

Contact info: President Carol C. Harter, Phone: 702-895-3201, Fax: 702-895-1088, harter@ccmail.nevada.edu. We have had reports that Harter's email has been taken down (not verified), so to be sure you could fax it or cc her staff listed here:
Kathleen Robins, Ph.D., Senior Advisor to the President; Schyler Richards
Deputy to the President; Betty Hanseen, Assistant to the President. Als: Dr. Raymond W. Alden III, Executive Vice President & Provost.

Other possible contact info: http://system.nevada.edu/Contact-Us/index.htm;
http://www.unlv.edu/main/boardRegents;
http://www.unlv.edu/president/cabinet.html#charter.

Here is some background information in the form of blogposts from the Mises blog, which contain a number of references to various articles discussing the hoopla:

Defend Hoppe
Lecture causes dispute
UNLV Regent warns "Professors have to be careful what they say."
UNLV Regents Chairman: Hoppe Should Not Be Disciplined
Political Correctness Crowd goes after Hoppe
The Volokh Conspiracy
Instapundit.com
Artists Under Attack, Muslims Against Advertising
Effort to punish UNLV professor gains exposure
The Thought Police Strike Nevada
UNLV Chooses Secrecy
Stifling free discourse at UNLV
Professor, ACLU may sue UNLV



(Post a new comment)


[info]full_of_wind
2005-02-12 05:18 am UTC (link)
This is ridiculous. Of course, I will send email and post by mail to his defense. His remarks are not anti-PC. They are logical. I can't believe this is even an issue.

(Reply to this)

Your Posts on Mr. Knight's Blog
(Anonymous)
2005-02-12 10:03 pm UTC (link)
I must commend you for the tenacity you've displayed on Mr. Knight's blog. (That I agree with your points may be taken as a given.) Many would have declined to add further posts, but I'm glad you've displayed the toughness to shoot down the weak rebuttals from the "starry-eyed" one. Better not to let them stand.

I really couldn't believe that she thinks whether someone takes offense is somehow a standard of what can/should be included in a lecture. (You may recall her comment somewhat along the lines of--paraphrasing--just because nobody ever complained doesn't mean nobody was offended). To me, the only standard should be whether something is logically defensible. In the old days, demonstrating the logical plausibility of a statement was sufficient; irrefutable proof of a statement's veracity was a lead pipe cinch defense. Now days, the truth in some cases is just too insensitive. Surely we must understand the need to "bend" or even delete uncomfortable truths in order that those tender souls (soles?) who attend "institutions of higher learning" may be shielded? A small price to pay (sarcasm). (I'm reminded of Jack Nicholson's famous line: "You can't handle the truth!")

Yes, 1984 is now in the past, and a fond recollection at that.

Keep up the good (rational) work!

(Reply to this)


[info]dunkelhaven
2005-02-12 11:33 pm UTC (link)
I have heard about it. This is quite absurd. Of course Prof. Hoppe is right.

(Reply to this) (Thread)


(Anonymous)
2005-02-13 04:10 am UTC (link)
I'm wondering why Professor Hoppe didn't just avoid any controversy and say that all heterosexuals have low time preferences? Maybe that's because Professor Hoppe realizes (as a heterosexual himself) that there is a large diversity in how straight people spend their money, and such a statement would be a bit ridiculous. Perhaps that's why he finds it easier to generalize about how all gay people spend their money...

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)


[info]jesterofsanity
2005-02-13 05:35 am UTC (link)
Perhaps I should generalize about how pregnant mothers spend their money, or how small children do. Of course, I am neither, so if I do so, does that make me prejudiced as well?

Creating groups with logical distinctions is not the same thing as prejudice.

(Reply to this) (Parent)


[info]dh003i
2005-02-13 07:47 am UTC (link)
You are creating a red herring. Prof. Hoppe explicitly said he was talking in generalities -- i.e., that (as an empirical fact) it doesn't apply to everyone, but is just an average. In fact, in the way he put it -- less children, riskier lifestyle -- it is a ceteris paribus statement, which is a priori true.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2005-03-17 07:54 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]dh003i, 2005-03-17 10:00 pm UTC
(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2005-03-17 11:08 pm UTC
(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2005-03-17 11:17 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]dh003i, 2005-03-17 11:20 pm UTC
(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2005-03-18 07:00 pm UTC

[info]dunkelhaven
2005-02-13 07:45 pm UTC (link)
I am gay myself and I don't feel offended by Prof. Hoppe's statement. The point is that Hoppe is clearly misunderstood if one thinks that in his opinion homosexuals per se had a higher time preference just because they are homosexual. But that is not the case. Prof Hoppe argues that the "average homosexual" might have (and I think actually does have) a higher time preference because he has no children. That does not mean that homosexual can't have a low time preference in a society where they are alowed to adopt children.

And even if his statement came out of a fit of homophobia, I don't think that that would be a reason to go mad at him from point of view of the government owned university. (Here one can recognize a fundamental problem of a government owning a university: Does a government have the right to discriminate against opinions it doesn't like when it is in the function of an employer and property owner? I don't think so!)

As I wrote in an recent essay of mine concerning the upcoming Anti Discrimination Law in Germany, racism is a problem of false, collectivist ideas and low self-esteem. If one wants to beat racism and similar problems, one needs to defeat the ideas behind. This can't be done by the government, because government has to be neutral in regard to the opinions of its citizens (otherwise it is a sort-of-theocracy). It has to be done via peaceful verbal argument.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]trancendenz, 2005-02-14 03:27 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]dunkelhaven, 2005-02-14 07:22 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]trancendenz, 2005-02-15 05:51 am UTC
of course - (Anonymous), 2005-02-20 05:50 pm UTC

(Anonymous)
2005-02-13 04:12 am UTC (link)
When you email Carol Harter, ask her about the articles Professor Hoppe submitted in his defense.

(Reply to this)

Thank You & Gruss Gott!
(Anonymous)
2005-02-13 07:13 am UTC (link)
David,
Thank you for your efforts with this very troublesome issue. I've seen your name and posts on a number of sources, and you've done a commendable job articulating reason and fairness.

I'm quite certain the responsibility for this mess does not lie with Knight; rather, this is a serious failure of personnel management by UNLV administrators. Every fact involved in this case suggests a total lack of competence by university staff in handling Knight's complaint. It's hard to fault Knight -- he's simply a misguided individual who should have been told to engage his professor with discussion about his concern.

By any reasonable measure, Knight's complaint is simply negligible. But what has transpired since the fateful lecture almost a year ago has become an embarrassment to the university, a sad, sad story of shoddy bureaucrats with no clue about intellectual integrity, academic freedom, or basic instructional conduct. At this point, concerned parties ought to seek reprimands of the UNLV administration (not Knight) for allowing this disgrace to happen.

You have apparently had contacts with Dr. Hoppe about this issue, and I encourage you to continue your work. I have e-mailed Carol Harter my opinions and will attempt to contact faculty members about voicing concern over the incident. With any luck, Hoppe will be vindicated, restored, compensated, and the administration will owe him -- and all of us -- a very big apology.

(Reply to this)


[info]trancendenz
2005-02-13 07:47 am UTC (link)
What's with the anon posting people?

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]dh003i
2005-02-13 07:54 am UTC (link)
You see, because I'm their libertarian dictator, everyone is afraid to show their real name to me ;-)

It's probably because the annonymous posters don't have LJ accounts.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)


(Anonymous)
2005-02-13 08:55 am UTC (link)
David,
I'll flatter you and let you pretend you're right about being the libertarian dictator (plus, you're right, I'm not a registered member with a LJ account.) But the truth is this: I'm an assistant professor at UNLV, and I'd rather not post my name because it would constitute a conflict of interest and/or jeopardize my own career. Plus, I'm a journalist, and I'd like to play a Deep Throat sort of role. For what it's worth, I'll be happy to continue to contribute, but if your other bloggers want to play antagonistic games, I'll just go back to work.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]dh003i, 2005-02-13 08:38 pm UTC

[info]cluebyfour
2005-02-13 09:51 am UTC (link)
You'll be thrilled (or not) to know that this flap has now made LJ Drama.

I don't disagree with the points you've made; what bothers me is that most people seem to be focusing on what Hoppe said and trying to characterize it as nothing more than a homophobic remark instead of evaluating it within the context of his argument. But taking things out of context and blowing them out of proportion seems to be all the rage on college campuses nowadays.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

a homophobic remark
(Anonymous)
2005-02-13 09:29 pm UTC (link)
In a free society, NOT the stuff of disciplinary action.

(Reply to this) (Parent)


(Anonymous)
2005-02-13 09:24 pm UTC (link)
Sehr geehrter Herr Heinrich:

I have also seen your posts on Mr. Knight's blog.

Keep up the good work against this persecution.

Best wishes,
J.K. Baltzersen

(Reply to this)

My optic nerves are going to break from the strain of rolling my eyes
[info]megabozz
2005-02-15 02:51 am UTC (link)
Check out Michael Knight's latest LJ entry: http://www.livejournal.com/users/aquariusguy702/23132.html

He asks 'I wonder what the Human Right's Coalition would think about this...'

Can he be serious? Is he actually this close to claiming that Hoppe's statements violated his "human rights"?

(Reply to this)

MESSAGE FROM PRESIDENT HARTER
(Anonymous)
2005-02-19 01:26 am UTC (link)
Many of you have followed the recent news reports regarding a complaint filed against UNLV economics professor Hans-Hermann Hoppe.

This matter has finally reached the level of presidential appeal, and I have completed my review. As a result, I have directed that the letter of instruction and related materials be withdrawn from Professor Hoppe’s personnel file and that no further action on this complaint be taken by the University. Attached below is a statement which further details my rationale for this decision.

As I have always said on behalf of the entire UNLV community, the tenets of academic freedom are of utmost importance to our campus environment, and it is my sincere hope that we steadfastly embrace this commitment as we embody the highest standards of education and inquiry.

Statement of Dr. Carol Harter, President of UNLV regarding Professor Hans-Hermann Hoppe

February 18, 2005
“I have reviewed the report of the Executive Vice President and Provost regarding the discrimination complaint filed by a student against Dr. Hoppe. Professor Hoppe is represented by the ACLU and counsel. I have written to his counsel today regarding my review.

Professor Hoppe has consistently held the opinion that his classroom materials consist of scholarly and relevant theories that have support in the academic economics community. I believe professors are entitled the freedom to teach theories and to espouse opinions that are out of the mainstream or are controversial.

It is my understanding that Professor Hoppe does not assert that materials he presents are the opinions of UNLV, nor has he ever purported to speak for UNLV. Whether anyone in the University agrees or disagrees with Professor Hoppe’s theories or his opinions is not ultimately relevant.

Teaching is of its nature and origin provocative. Faculty are called upon to challenge students, to push them to a greater understanding, and to encourage them to question the current base of knowledge and, in so doing, to create new knowledge.

UNLV, in accordance with policy adopted by the Board of Regents, understands that the freedom afforded to Professor Hoppe and to all members of the academic community carries a significant corresponding academic responsibility. In the balance between freedoms and responsibilities, and where there may be ambiguity between the two, academic freedom must, in the end, be foremost.

UNLV considers this matter closed.”

(Reply to this) (Thread)

Re: MESSAGE FROM PRESIDENT HARTER
(Anonymous)
2005-02-20 06:00 pm UTC (link)
I went to UNLV's homepage for a new link to the president's statement. None there, but now in the "Latest news" section we have a link to "Vagina Monologues" benefit. It seems quite appropriate that there is consistency in the agenda of UNLV. This institution that should have been entrusted with the developing minds of young adults is nothing more that a staging point for a pluralist and sexually deviant brainwashing.

(Reply to this) (Parent)

Your defense of Mr. Hoppe
(Anonymous)
2005-02-21 11:07 pm UTC (link)
Dear Mr. Heinrich,

I have responded to your comment on my website regarding Mr. Hoppe's unfortunate experiences. (I tried to email you back, but there was a problem with your email address, hence this comment on your website.)

The comment is at:
http://www.tomgpalmer.com/archives/018766.php#comments

Cordially,
Tom G. Palmer


(Reply to this)


[info]tiny1219
2005-03-02 12:31 am UTC (link)
I am in one of Professor Hoppe's classes this semester where he has discussed the same topic. I am also a graduating senior from the Economics department.
I find it quite disconcerting that a student in the Economics department would create such an uproar about a theory that can be proven. It shows that besides your basic business applications in Economics, the students (at UNLV) are not interested in the discipline as a social science (or even know that it is a social science.) However, it is this sort of nonrational thinking that I am used to here at UNLV.
I have been following the affair rather closely; however, I missed Knight's appearance at the Senate meeting last night. I was curious to hear of his damning evidence.

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]dh003i
2005-03-02 02:55 am UTC (link)
Thanks alot for the info. I bet Knight took plenty of quotes out of context at the Senate meeting.

(Reply to this) (Parent)

(Screened Post)
Re: the time preference of rapists
(Anonymous)
2005-03-11 10:30 pm UTC (link)
oh yeah, and I also signed the hoppe victory blog as someone who does find his offensive and repulsive. How's that?

(Reply to this) (Parent)

Re: the time preference of rapists
[info]dh003i
2005-03-12 01:15 am UTC (link)
Thanks alot for posting. I like hearing from friends from Mises University.

In any event, I think I remember you. Do you also have tattoos on your arms, that are black in color? Straight brown hair? (Or at least last summer during Mises U)? If I remember right, we were sitting in the dorm lobby with some 5 or 6 people, talking about God and demons, and all kinds of interesting stuff.

Anyways, I thought your story was really interesting. It never occured to me that Prof. Hoppe's comment might offend some women (If anything, I thought it would be more offensive to men ;-). I just took it as him playing on a typical stereotype. Anyways, it was interesting reading about it. I'm glad things worked out the way they did.

Were you also at Prof. Block's lecture on anti-woman discrimination and the glass ceiling? If you don't remember, I have notes on it here. I talked to several women at the lecture, and they didn't seem so offended, so I'm just curious what you thought. Prof. Block did note, however, that normally, the crowd would be hissing at him by that point in the lecture.

Are you going to be going to the Mises University again this year? If so, I'll see you there. Btw, if you wanna chat online, or send me an e-mail, my online IM name is dh003i in AOL and Yahoo! My e-mail address is heinrich@rochester.rr.com

--Dave H.

PS: You don't think I was too harsh on Michael Knight, do ya?

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

Re: the time preference of rapists
(Anonymous)
2005-03-12 04:22 am UTC (link)
yeah that was me. I was irritated by Block's lecture and spoke to him about it later. I don't understand why he has such a stake in certain theories. But his lecture was irritating, not menacing. The thing is, several researchers on rape have concluded that rapists aren't generally crazy, they just tend to think that there is nothing wrong with it. So it is slightly disconcerting to be one of maybe three women in a room of 50 people and hear them chuckle about it. Especially when you are sharing a dorm with these people. A hostile learning environment indeed. Offensive to men, menacing to women. I don't know, I really didn't care for it, and I still don,t like Hoppe much, but whatever. Either way, I was responsible for my own reaction to his statements, and had I really cared I guess I would have spoken to him about it. I like Block, and consider him a friend, so I bother with him when he says something offensive. No I don't think you were to hard on Knight, the guy needs someone to tell him to stop being such a bitch about it. Even though I feel like I had a more legitimate complaint against Hoppe, I would never have considered trying to damage his career over it. Such would be the action of a weak crybaby bitch, which is obviously what Knight is. Anyway, I won't be able to make it to MisesU, but I was thinking about trying to go to Block's seminar. Talk to you later

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

Re: the time preference of rapists - [info]dh003i, 2005-03-12 04:31 pm UTC
Re: the time preference of rapists - (Anonymous), 2005-03-13 05:14 am UTC
Re: the time preference of rapists - (Anonymous), 2005-03-13 05:15 am UTC
Re: the time preference of rapists - (Anonymous), 2005-03-13 05:16 am UTC
Re: the time preference of rapists - (Anonymous), 2005-03-13 08:14 am UTC
Re: the time preference of rapists - [info]dh003i, 2005-03-14 05:25 am UTC
just so we're on the same page - [info]dh003i, 2005-03-15 12:34 am UTC
Re: just so we're on the same page - (Anonymous), 2005-03-15 09:04 am UTC
Re: just so we're on the same page - [info]dh003i, 2005-03-15 09:46 pm UTC
Re: just so we're on the same page - (Anonymous), 2005-03-16 02:22 am UTC
Re: just so we're on the same page - (Anonymous), 2005-03-16 02:22 am UTC
Re: just so we're on the same page - (Anonymous), 2005-03-16 03:06 am UTC
Re: just so we're on the same page - [info]dh003i, 2005-03-16 05:04 am UTC
Re: just so we're on the same page - (Anonymous), 2005-03-16 05:18 am UTC
Re: just so we're on the same page - [info]dh003i, 2005-03-16 06:17 am UTC
Re: just so we're on the same page - [info]dh003i, 2005-03-16 04:35 am UTC
PS - [info]dh003i, 2005-03-16 04:37 am UTC
PPS - [info]dh003i, 2005-03-16 05:15 am UTC
Re: just so we're on the same page - (Anonymous), 2005-03-16 05:35 am UTC
Re: just so we're on the same page - [info]dh003i, 2005-03-16 06:28 am UTC

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